Speaker 1 (
Hi, I am Mary Ellen Egan, the senior editor for Women's Programs at American Banker. I'm here with Tasnim Ghiawadwala.
Speaker 2 (
Perfect. Great.
Speaker 1 (
Should I go? Yes. Okay. Hi, I am Mary Ellen Egan, senior editor of Women's Program at American Banker. I'm here with Tasnim Ghiawadwala, who is the global head of commercial Bank at Citi. Tasnim, thank you so much for joining us today.
Speaker 2 (
Thank you very much for having me.
Speaker 1 (
So I want to talk about a little bit about the core group that you serve. So you serve over 14,000 midsize companies. So what are some of the biggest challenges your clients are facing in this current environment?
Speaker 2 (
Yeah, so, no surprises, I'm sure for you to hear some of the common challenges that our clients are facing. So inflation and the cost of inputs to their businesses is rising, the cost of labor is rising, and interest rates are rising. That's also another cost for business. So you know, how to deal with the costs, how much absorption capacity the companies have, and how much can be passed on to their customers as well. So, just working through all of that I think is quite a challenge for our clients. But I think mostly what we find is that companies who are savvy, who have been around a while, who have seen the ups and downs of various economic cycles, they're managing quite well.
Speaker 1 (
I think we've been hearing there might be a recession, there might not be a recession, there might be a recession, there might not be a recession. And so, as you said, so the people that have been through these kind of cycles before know how to buffer their businesses, so to speak.
Speaker 2 (
Absolutely. And we have a global client base, so we are working with clients across all of the continents and many clients have seen in their own countries. For example, if you've got clients in Brazil, they would've seen hyperinflation in the past. In the U.K., there's been a lot of cycles. And in the U.S., of course, lots of different cycles have happened here as well. So I think that it sort of shows in the client base—which ones are the more experienced ones that can deal with it, and have various scenarios that they've been working on to roll out. And then we tend to get very good feedback from our clients around how they're managing through these times.
Speaker 1 (
And one of the things, one of your priorities has been the development of a digital banking portal, portal, kind of a one-stop shop for your clients. So why is that important to Citi and why is that so important for your clients?
Speaker 2 (
So I think from a client perspective, it's
Speaker 1 (
Speaker 2 (
Just ease of use. I think clients need to have tools available to them that make banking easy, that aggregate things in one place for them. So they're not having to log onto multiple different applications. They're not having to have half things on paper, half things digitally. So for us at Citi, we can offer so many different products and solutions to our clients, actually really complex products and solutions to our clients. And what we've done with our digital portal is kind of aggregate all of those capabilities into one interface so that your average commercial banking client can becomes the gateway into Citi and a very digital, digitally savvy and easy to use tool for our clients. We are, we've rolled it out in the U.S., so we've got about 80% of our clients in the U.S. now using it. It only got rolled out in the last couple of months and now in the second half of the year we're going to be piloting it and launching it in three Asian markets and the U.K. as well. So really looking to roll it out globally over time.
Speaker 1 (
And I assume that's also a global competitive advantage for Citi to be able to have that kind of ease of a client, a commercial client being able to access what they need through a portal instead of, as you said, trying to go through a different mix and match.
Speaker 2 (
Absolutely. And then I think what this allows us to do is give a commercial client or a corporate client that same kind of look and feel that the retail experience that you know and I would be having when we're dealing with our own banking affairs—that it's easy to use, it's very intuitive, you don't need any special training. The entitlements that you have, the security underlying it is high grade for companies that all the fraud elements and that are all being taken care of in the right way as well. So I think it is hopefully going to be a massive competitive advantage for us to bring all the products of Citi under this one digital platform. And then also we're adding in service, we're adding in onboarding and making those kind of digital journeys all part of the same portal as well. So that again, it's all back to that ease of use and excellent client experience that we want, that we strive for.
Speaker 1 (
Do you think is fraud a big concern for your clients, for the corporate clients, or is that...
Speaker 2 (
Well, I think fraud is a concern for everybody. And the incident of fraud is continually on the rise. The fraudsters are getting more and more innovative, and so having the right tools, having the right client education as well is very, very important around how clients can protect themselves and how we as a bank can help the clients in that endeavor as well.
Speaker 1 (
So I want to switch gears a little bit and talk about that. You've been a big proponent of diversity and inclusion at Citi. Citi has actually been one of the industry leaders in DE&I. So what do you think, going forward, we're looking at where we could take this make, what kind of, we made some inroads, obviously as we know, not probably as much as anyone would like to make or see. So what kind of suggestions do you have or are there some innovation that's going on now at Citi that's going to help keep that path, that train moving, so to speak?
Speaker 2 (
Yeah, absolutely. So I think Citi has for many, many years now had an enormous focus on diversity, equity and inclusion. And we have been at the forefront in terms of getting various initiatives throughout the organization, ranging from the most junior talents as it comes in, ensuring that we're very equitable in the way we hire, and then having all the various programs, VP development, sponsorship director development, all those kind of programs in place to support people through their careers. We like to think of ourselves as a very human bank and I think we really are a human bank. I think the next kind of wave around all of this is going to be, for me, as I think about how we can do more in this space is around social mobility and just ensuring that not only are we, for example, getting the right kind of levels of women at different levels of seniority and work, but also that social mobility and that it's women from different classes, different areas of society that also have access to the same opportunities. And so I think that that will be the way in which we can continue to evolve and play an important role here.
Speaker 1 (
That's really interesting you bring that up because I think that sometimes if you're like, okay, we want to get more women in, but if you're going to women who went through Ivy League schools, that's far easier than somebody like me went through public university and funded their way through. That's a different deal.
Speaker 2 (
Exactly. So it's a nuance, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (
Speaker 2 (
It's a nuance, and I think I always say there's many ways it's going to catch, right, right. And so I think we've done really well in terms of having large numbers now of managing directors that are women at Citi and that. But I think having that kind of nuance around the social mobility and making sure that we play a role in that area as well, I think is going to be very important.
Speaker 1 (
That's interesting. So you've held a number of leadership positions over the years and what I think sometimes, I mean I think about when I first started my career and what leadership used to look like was more authoritarian— 'I'll tell you what to do and I don't need to listen to you.' A little junior person I think that come on control. Yes, exactly. Command and control. It's like going up against a dad, but I think it's changed and I think it's gotten more humanized so to speak. And so what do you think is important for you as a leader? Or what do you look for in traits of a leader?
Speaker 2 (
Yeah, absolutely. So I think as a leader, and it doesn't matter, whatever you're running. It doesn't really matter whether you're running an operations department or you're running a front office area. I think you've got to have high belief and high conviction in whatever it is that you are in charge of and that you're leading. Because I think only then, if you believe it yourself, then you can really inspire others to follow you and to really aspire themselves to help you in that goal that you may have. So I think having that kind of conviction and belief, I think always been positive. I mean, life brings a lot of ups and downs, careers bring a lot of ups and downs, and I think you've got to be able to deal with that and still maintain a positive attitude because there's a lot of people watching— I think there are a lot of people watching and looking up and seeing how you're reacting to things. And so I think being able to hold that positive attitude, be enthusiastic even when the chips are down because you need to do that for your team, because if you are all down and out and complaining and all of that, I mean, yeah, that's not going to do a lot of good for your team who will tend to emulate what they see.
Speaker 1 (
Right, true.
Speaker 2 (
And then I think, particularly in my work, where the customer and the client is so important to everything that we do, maintaining that client centricity, really thinking through every action and all the initiatives that we're working on, all things. And just trying to think what impact does that have on a client, because I think that should always be the North Star. And I think when your team members see you putting the client first, really understanding the impact of everything that you're doing in the terms of what a client is looking for, I think it sort of makes your job a bit easier as well. Again, in trying to inspire your team and to help them understand why we're here, what is the purpose here? It is to serve our clients. Right.
Speaker 1 (
Thank you so much for your time today. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (
It. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (
So can I ask, we're going to ask just some general questions just for background, just for the B roll, for the gala video. So, how has industry changed for women since you started and where do you think strides have been made and where maybe we need to a little bit more effort on?
Speaker 2 (
I think it's changed enormously for women. I think it's probably the best time to be a woman I think in this industry. I think back to when I started my career in banking about 25 years ago, I would be the only person in the room. The entire table would be full of men or I'd go to a conference and again, I might be the only kind of lowly woman, most junior as well probably in the room. And I think now just the sheer numbers of women that you see around is very heartening. I think in terms of what more is to do, I think it's still insufficient in terms of where we're at. I think, I don't think there's any company that has 50% managing directors that are women where the people are doing well and Citi has done really well, and every year we make progress, but I think there's still room to grow and more. And I think we have to be creative and try to understand what is it that can hold women into a career of banking over a long, long period of time.
Speaker 1 (
Right. I was going to say, I think there's some dropout about midway. Yes, you can get them in the door, but then how do we keep them to get them up to that level? Do you think being a parent is part of it? Do you think it's feeling like I don't see a role model ahead of me, or what do you think are some of the, I know it's multifaceted. It's not one thing.
Speaker 3 (
I'm sorry. I'm sorry. This,
Speaker 2 (
It's something annoying.
Speaker 1 (
Should I, do I need to repeat or
Speaker 3 (
Yes. Okay.
Speaker 1 (
Well, yeah, one of the things we're talking about is so you can get women in the door, but then how do you keep them to get them to the higher levels? Because there's this mid-career dropout or attrition. We see it, I'm sure the problem is very complex, obviously, but is a part parenthood is a part feeling like, well, I don't see women above me, so I don't know the path through, or what do you think some of the problems might be there?
Speaker 2 (
I think biology definitely has something to do with it and people thinking about when's the right time to have family. And then they take a little bit of time out and I think it sort of takes them off the treadmill, I'm going to say right, for a period of time. And then it does become that much harder to either get back into the career at the same level. I mean, I think there's certain things that banks can do. For example, one of the things that we've been looking at is how we can ensure that if a woman who's a banker, for example, is covering a portfolio of clients to make sure that somebody kind of takes care of those clients while they're on maternity leave and that they're given back to the individual and not distributed amongst the team. And then it's when the woman comes back, she's got no portfolio and has to start again from the beginning.
(
So I think those kinds of measures, just being really tactical about ensuring that we don't make it hard for people to come back who want to come back. I mean, the other thing that we've had some quite decent success at is returners program—people who have been out of the industry for five years or even 10 years, and then having a program by which they can come back in, maybe into an alternative, still within banking, but an alternative career within banking. So I think just having been a bit more creative around things like that, I think is probably the way to go.
Speaker 1 (
And one other thing I think we're looking at, obviously now we want to get the younger generation into banking and finance, and they seem very motivated by, I want to be fulfilled and might not look at banking or finance. And so how do we look to get the younger generation in there and interested in banking, and is there an image problem? What kind of mindset do you think that needs to help shape them to understand that it's not just about numbers?
Speaker 2 (
No, I think one of the things I've sort of found sometimes when I speak to say university undergraduates, and that is they actually don't really have a good understanding of what it means to be a banker. I think what they perceive, and what it actually is, there's quite a gap. And I think one of the things that I find really interesting about banking is that you actually get to really understand business and you actually get to understand what clients do, what their day-to-day problems are, how we're talking about some of the issues that clients face as a banker, you have to really understand all of that and understand where the client's at, and then by having a really good understanding of their issues. But then also having a great relationship with the client where they put a bit of trust in you and in the advice that you can give them to help them out.
(
And there's nothing more rewarding than seeing a client that might be at a crossroads—they don't quite know what to do, or they're in trouble in some way, and being able to help provide advice and provide some solutions that kind of helps them navigate through that period and then thrive again. Because running a business, and it doesn't matter whether it's a private business or large multinational business, it's not a smooth road. Every company will go through difficult periods of time. And I think as a banker, if you can work with clients over a long period of time and help them navigate all of that, it's actually very, very fulfilling to be able to, and you get a lot of satisfaction out of it. And I think explaining that and what the role of a banker really is—it's not sitting at a desk doing spreadsheets and sending out a letter, offering a loan or something that sort of, almost a very small part of banking. The bigger part of banking is really working very, very closely with clients and understanding what their issues are.
Speaker 1 (
So it's more relationship because I think we all see, they always have legal movies and they're always a lawyer. And you say see the lawyer, and every knows what lawyers do, but if you ask me what a banker did, I'd be, oh, I don't know.. So maybe they need to make a banker movie and make it part thriller part, and then they'll be like, oh, it's like Indiana Jones is a banker now, I get it.
Speaker 2 (
No, absolutely. And I think what if I take my two daughters, for example? One of them definitely didn't want to become a banker, the other one didn't even want to become a banker, but is now becoming a banker. And I think it's only when you start to understand that it is actually really, really interesting. Some of the problems we have to deal with. And particularly as you get into more leadership roles as well, then you come away from being only covering clients to managing teams of bankers. Then, as a leader, you get really stretched dealing with people, issues, figuring out how you're going to grow a business. There's a lot of strategy that's kind of built into some of these roles. And I think as undergraduates hear and learn more about it, I think it's probably really up there in terms of the top kind of few jobs that actually give you both mental stimulation as well as a lot of satisfaction, feeling that you've made a difference to a business or a client or somebody at work.
Speaker 1 (
When you think about the intellectual curiosity you'd have to do, because you have a, let's say one of your clients is a trucking company for instance, but then you have another one who's absolutely whatever, industrials or whatever, healthcare, healthcare company, which is so different. So you have to learn different business models as well and different understand what they do. And so it seems like it's a good career for somebody who's wants to continually learn as you have to and continually be curious about the world, and not just the business world, but the world, because it all feeds into each other.
Speaker 2 (
And if you take your example just now of you've got a client, say they're a healthcare company, as a banker, you have to figure out where does that company stack up in the industry? Is it a winner? Is it a loser? If it's a loser, then why is it losing? Can you help them become a winner? Can you share information about what's going on in the industry? What are some of the top business models that you have seen that this company can learn from? So I think it's having that appreciation, taking the knowledge that you are building by working with all sorts of clients, and then bringing those ideas to your clients as well for their benefits.
Speaker 1 (
So now my last question. So we're talking about, you have a daughter now who's going into banking. So what kind of advice do you have for a young woman, such as your daughter going into banking? What would you wish that you had known when you went in or, I mean, there's, we know times change, but what do you think would be valuable for her to know?
Speaker 2 (
So I think one, again, one a bit of misconception about banking is that the only roles within banking are bankers, right? They're like, banking is full of so many different roles. You can be a lawyer within a bank, you can be a tech person. In fact, if you are in technology, you'll work on some of the most high-end, most innovative technology projects that are available in the entire industry. And of course, you can be a banker, you can be in risk. So there are a lot of different roles. And I think the other thing that, again, people might not be aware of, is that it's quite easy to move around. So, you can actually enter in one part of the bank and move around and gain a really broad and valuable experience. I mean, I've had the benefit of doing that in my own career. And I've moved around different departments within banking.
(
I've been in the investment bank, I've been a CFO, I now run a Gglobal commercial Bbank. So I've had a lot of different experiences, and I think banking does offer that to people. It's not like you join as a banker and you kind of end as a banker. And also, in a bank like Citi, a global bank, the opportunities for working in exotic locations are very much there. And so really, I think if you are looking for a career in banking, looking for experiences outside of the U.S. or outside of your home country, then these kind of companies are really there to kind of help you out.
Speaker 1 (
Well, thank you again so much for your time. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (
Thank you. Thank you for having me. You're welcome.